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newclosefarm
United Kingdom
124 Posts |
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GOS
459 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Mar 2010 : 14:35:32
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| The BPA Reps are Andrew Robinson and Dave Overton. Both can be found under 'The Club' tab above - 'Contact Details'. |
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CarrHallPigs
United Kingdom
141 Posts |
Posted - 02 Mar 2010 : 21:06:38
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right, if you're tattoo'ing from beginning not a problem, you said you had tags up to 50 so would have to start tattoo'ing from number 51 on your previous post, hence why assumed you were tagging until number 50 and why said unsure on how it lies with changing from tagging to tattoo'ing 
if it's your first lot you start from number one I'd say 
letters one ear, numbers the other |
http://carrhallpigs.jimdo.com/ |
Edited by - CarrHallPigs on 02 Mar 2010 21:10:13 |
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stephen booth
204 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 09:11:00
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| Please contact you Reps . The last posting is only partially correct. |
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CarrHallPigs
United Kingdom
141 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 10:57:24
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If something I got from a BPA rep on the phone is incorrect all can say is oh dear, I'm just thinking from when I asked them what to do if crossbred my sows which was contemplating at one point when our boar died and couldn't locate a suitable one at the time, we then did luckily so it didn't happen but I phoned to ask about how to number them if did......I was told management number and herdmark...is that wrong then? I was told they don't affect the numbering of the pedigree one's and to keep them seperate numbers, again is this incorrect, or should we if had crossbred, followed on the numbers, say if the last pedigree one was 35, then tattoo the first crossbred as 36?
it's even worse not knowing got the wrong info when asked!! 
if folks could point out the right way and ensure a newer keeper is shown the way am sure it'd be gratefully received, isn't that what folks are here for, to help newer keepers to keep this lovely breed going? I've only had pigs for a short time and it feels like you're running in the dark trying to find out the right way, even the BPA is confusing.
it feels like you're an excluded village idiot at times, it's very offputting, maybe that's why not many show now, it's put me off I'll admit, I'd hate to be laughed at for getting it wrong, which I inevitably would in the show ring, so I've avoided going even though have had invites!
the most popular in numbers breed is the one least seen at shows.....why, questions need asking, the way to promote the breed is to get it out there and seen, but if folks are put off thinking they just aren't knowledgable enough...?
I wanted to ask why Dolly didn't have her HDL on her movement paperwork from you because it's the first time that hasn't been on movement forms along with others...dare I ask, should I don the flameproof suit first and hide behind the couch? dare I ask if that awful button movement number tag can be taken out before it's ripped out, I'd hate to have her ear ripped because of it, it's why I prefer tattooing.
see there's another thing, I was under the impression when they were tattoo'd they didn't need a plastic movement tag putting in as were identified, that's another one had asked the BPA! things are so unclear, maybe someone could sticky some simple easy to follow rules and reg's on tattoo's, etc on the top of the individual forums and we could all learn, if there is some somewhere already I apologise for missing them!!
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http://carrhallpigs.jimdo.com/ |
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newclosefarm
United Kingdom
124 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 12:16:13
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| I think you're right someone out there somewhere must know the correct way of doing this so a sticky post would be great. I will contact the BPA to clarify what I need to do. |
Charlotte
www.new-close-farm.co.uk |
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stephen booth
204 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 15:30:31
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I did state PARTIALLY CORRECT. Not that what was put was wrong. It is important that postings are read thoroughly on such matters. I am not the BPA Rep for this Breed and it is the Reps who do know the answers. Dare i suggest far better than the ladies in the BPA Office who do their very best , but have never had any practical experience of doing tattooing of pigs. Described in the last post is how a boar should be tattooed , and yet is only partially correct in itself as it does not explain the correct ear for each of those tattos. It does matter that people understand the information given , and to put partial information in these web pages does not help . Therefore i say again seak directly to a Rep of this Breed and even if its for a second or third time so you are clear about the tattos you put in the piglets ear .That mark will be permanent.
Can you tell me if you recieved the litterature from the BPA ,when you joined the Organisation ,that explained all this ? It should have been recieved along with your Herd Name and HDL information from the BPA Office. |
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stephen booth
204 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 15:59:43
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Re Dolly 18 . The HDL is not in the ear as it is not required to be . The tag is in the ear as she was a show animal and the law states she must have a movement tag in to travel anywhere other than holding to holding when under 12 months of age . So to move to yourself at over 12 month she did require a tag and not just a crayon mark. As for the paperwork the identity requirement is for the information on the tag which is about my holding (NOT CPH but Trading Standard Designated Letters (2)) and an individual number. The pedigree identity is shown by her tatoo and that will correspond to the Pedigree Certificate you recieve from the BPA , or can check in the on line herd book.
I admit there seems to be total chaos caused by tags having any place in a pigs pedigree identity. However the rules do allow that at this moment in time. The information required on a tag for Movement and Pedigree status is further confusing people. I personally think it time to cease tags having any part in Pedigree identity, then tattoo rules would seem simpler. Tags would then only be required in the main , by show or auctioned pigs. Travelling under 12 month holding to holding of weaners to in pig gilts would still be covered by a crayon mark , and all pedigree status by its tattoo, Pigs to slaughter could be tagged or slap marked as now.
The odd part about a BPA Rep's job is that the BPA insist they give you the information available so you can make a choice . Crazily this is not an informed choice as you rightly state you are new and wish to be helped. That is why i ask you to keep asking the Rep so each time you call the options are reduced and you can get to how it should be done.
This "mess" is not your ,or any other Breed Reps fault. It is the system they are forced to adhere too by their newly sanctioned "job description" which they HAD TO AGREE TO before being allwed to stand for election to office .
Some people may say the situation is stupid. I could not possibly comment as i am a Rep for another Breed and i am sure you can tell by this posting just how frustrating the whole situation of being a Breed Rep has become for myself and some others. Yes I can see mistakes , but i have to follow a protocol, or resign and walk away which is fast becoming the simple option. Yet that is not going to resolve the pickle things appear to have gotten into |
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sally lugg
10 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 16:03:50
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The confusion seems to be with the bpa requirements for pedigree registration and the legal requirements re movements.
cross bred pigs do not need to be identified as presumably all would go for slaughter- they would then need a metal tag or slapmark with your defra herdmark- 2 letters, 4 numbers when they leave for the abattoir.
tattooing- first pig you breed has no 1 tattooed in it's ear, second no 2 and so on- begin with boars and then gilts of each litter. this information is put onto the birth note form- you will then receive a birth note confirmation form which gives a number for each pig in the litter. If you decide to register one of the litter you will have the choice of naming it using it's ear number ie primrose muriel 850 or with the number of pigs you have registered since your herd began. I find it much simpler to use the ear no method.
There is no need to tag any pig until it is moved onto another holding, show etc as the tattoo will allow you to identify that animal. Before that movement takes place the pig must be identified
to comply with uk law - button tag with defra herdmark and a number for management purposes- that's why your dolly has a tag as well as her tattoo. If that tag should fall out and is moved again you will have to use one with your herd mark.
On the AML form the identifying mark would be the defra herdmark and the number on the plastic tag - HDL is not required
full information re movement of pigs and their identification can be found on defra website- |
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GOS
459 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2010 : 20:07:37
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| Just in case you haven't spotted it, I have taken your suggestion and added a sticky at the front of this section which hopefully explains the process step by step. |
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Fiona
42 Posts |
Posted - 04 Jul 2010 : 20:55:10
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| GOS, please would you forward me a copy of the email re; ear tattooing, many thanks fi.pratt@btopenworld.com |
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CarrHallPigs
United Kingdom
141 Posts |
Posted - 06 Jul 2010 : 11:43:58
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oops missed this one, but yes I did receive the bumph from the BPA, was about as clear as mud, as is normal when trying to get info from any quarter about these things.....
and fair enough partially correct but then again when you're taking info off what you're given how are we supposed to get it right.
sally thank you, your post is far less condescending and far more enlightening too, really appreciate it, as a newer keeper it's fighting a losing battle to try to do right and the obvious exasperation you're faced with when ask is extremely offputting
therefore folks read what get from bpa - after all it's right  follow their half advice, do it wrong then get jumped on by the 'experts' who seem to take great delight in knocking new keepers down and showing us all just how much they know...
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http://carrhallpigs.jimdo.com/ |
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Fiona
42 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jul 2010 : 08:23:47
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| GOS- received thank you! |
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how to tattoo help?
